People tend to assume that selling and negotiating is an innate talent. “You either have it, or you don’t,” many would say – based on an archetypical image of the sales champion. Mike Lander is a sales and negotiation champion, but he wouldn’t agree with that quote. His sales and negotiation consulting business, Piscari, assesses individual skills to get the most out of any type of sales profile. We discussed a gem of a training needs analysis example. The assessment he built with Pointerpro:
The assessment and associated insights have enabled my consultancy to build deeper, trusted relationships with strategic partners, that have material long-term value to my business – Mike Lander (Founder of Piscari)
Mike: Yes, the business is called Piscari. We mostly work with marketing agencies, technology/engineering firms and professional services firms. We help them better qualify sales opportunities, get shortlisted more frequently and negotiate more profitable deals when they’ve been selected as the potential preferred supplier.
The company consists mainly of myself and occasionally a few associates. Contextually, I’m an ex-procurement director. So, I used to be a buyer and now I work with sellers. Some say I’m a gatekeeper turned poacher.
Mike: No, it’s always business-to-business (B2B).
Mike: So, before using Pointerpro, I used many of the typical online survey tools. They’re easy to get going and they’re relatively low-cost. But they only get you so far. Generally, whenever I was doing a training needs analysis for a customer – a TNA – I’d build a quick survey. It’d be 12 questions I’d send out to all the delegates, get the answers back and that would give me some insights into who they are: their deal sizes, conversion rates, negotiation challenges, etc. For something quick and easy like that, generic online tools are great.
But when it comes to conducting more comprehensive assessments and deeper research into specific, complex topics, then you’ll basically struggle.
I wanted to assess whether specific skills and attributes would lead to better negotiation outcomes. But when you try to do something like that, most online survey tools – other than Pointerpro – fall short. – Mike Lander (Founder of Piscari)
Mike: What I wanted to do was an in-depth research study into the negotiation skills of salespeople and how that correlates to negotiation outcomes. I wanted to assess whether specific skills and attributes would lead to better negotiation outcomes. But when you try to do something like that, most online survey tools – other than Pointerpro – fall short.
One of the biggest reasons is that they don’t allow for conditional logic in the output report. I wanted the report to be tailored based on the responses given – so that each participant would receive insights specific to their answers.
The second challenge was the quality of the output report. With most of the lower-cost online tools, the reports just don’t look professional enough in a B2B environment. When I’m working with large companies in sales and negotiation coaching and consulting, there’s an expectation of high-quality deliverables. I needed a polished, branded PDF report that looked professional and incorporated conditional logic.
And third, I wanted to eventually distribute this assessment so that other consultants could white-label it and use it with their own clients. That scalability was really important to me, and that’s what led me to Pointerpro.
Mike: I do. I investigated quite a lot online about different tools for doing in-depth research with customers. I think there were about three tools that I really looked at. One was Pointerpro and some others, of which I can’t remember the names. Then I found someone who’d used Pointerpro, and then had a chat. Finally, I ended up talking to one of your solution salespeople and selected Pointerpro.
Coincidentally this is a key takeaway about how most buyers conduct research today. Probably 90% of the decision-making process happens before ever speaking to a salesperson. That’s a big shift from 15 years ago when maybe only 25% of the research was done independently, and the other 75% involved direct interaction with a salesperson.
When I’m working with large companies in sales and negotiation coaching and consulting, there’s an expectation of high-quality deliverables. I needed a polished, branded PDF report that looked professional. – Mike Lander (Founder of Piscari)
Mike: It was a really interesting intellectual exercise for me. My customers often say I have deep expertise in negotiation, which is kind of them, and I’ve spent a lot of time understanding how to help people get better results. With that background, I built a simple model in PowerPoint, mapping out the different possible negotiation outcomes. From there, I identified the skills required to achieve each outcome, listed them out, and grouped them into six skill categories. So I kind of built the model intellectually, on a few pieces of paper initially.
I then started refining the questions that would assess those skills and determine whether there was a correlation between skill sets and negotiation outcomes. But one key insight came from a conversation I had with Matt Dixon, co-author of The Challenger Sale. When I told him about my idea, he advised me to work with a statistician – someone experienced in designing large-scale surveys – to ensure the questions were structured correctly and that we could do the analysis required across hundreds of respondents. He introduced me to Kevin Acker, and that turned out to be invaluable.
Mike: The way questions are worded, the rating scales used, and the consistency in scoring all play a crucial role. If there’s bias or inconsistency in the design, you can’t establish a reliable statistical correlation between skills and outcomes.
That was a critical learning point. In fact, I initially designed the tool myself, then had Kevin review it, and we ended up redesigning it based on his feedback. In the end, we produced a high-quality research report, which ended up being featured in a Forbes article.
Mike: It’s massively important. As an engineer by training, I see everything as an experiment – you need to test, learn, and refine. For anyone doing this for the first time, start with a solid model and – if you have access to one – have it reviewed by a statistician.
Then, run a small test with 10-20 people, analyze the output, and ensure you’re asking the right questions to get the insights you need. Once everything checks out, scale it up. It’s definitely a step-by-step process to achieve high-quality outcomes.
Mike: The training needs analysis tool serves two key purposes. First, in the classic “awareness-interest-decision-action” framework, it helps raise awareness. I collaborated with partners who had my ideal customers in their network, shared the questionnaire, and we saw a great response rate. This put me on their radar and showcased my insights.
Second, for our customers in training programs. I let them complete the questionnaire, which generates a tailored report. This gives them valuable information to reflect on before the training – far more detailed than a simple six-question online survey would provide.
Mike: Yes, if they buy the extra report. Basically, the standard report gives you a negotiation maturity indicator. The extended paid report includes their sales negotiation archetype. Based on the data from the questionnaire we can then identify their corresponding archetype.
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Country Manager Netherlands at Better Minds at Work
Mike: The analysis confirmed what people instinctively know but lack the research to prove. Namely, that trust is a critical factor in high-stakes negotiations that create a lot of value for both parties. When done right, both parties get significant value; when done wrong, one claims more than the other.
To build trust, you need time, active listening, and joint problem-solving. Our research showed a strong correlation between trust-building skills and successful negotiated outcomes. Conversely, the old-school “bang the table” approach may deliver short-term wins but fails in long-term, high-value deals. We called this archetype “Commanders”.
Mike: That’s a very good question. I believe all human-beings can evolve. Otherwise we would have died 2,5 million years ago.
However, it takes a high level of emotional intelligence to step back and realize when something isn’t working. Many people assume they must always be a trust builder in negotiations, but that’s not true. If you’re negotiating a low-stakes deal with many suppliers – like a commodity purchase – you don’t necessarily need to invest time in building high-trust; it’s a tactical buy.
However, if you’re negotiating something high-impact, like a high-impact digital transformation program with limited suppliers, trust-building is crucial. In these cases, both the buyer and seller should take the time to develop a strong, trusting relationship.
Mike: Customer centric, both for me and the end-user. The latter is even more important to me. A person who takes the training needs assessment goes through circa 60 questions. That’s why I clearly say that at the beginning of the questionnaire they’ll need 15-20 minutes and they’d better get a cup of tea ready.
Mike: That’s right. So there’s a real incentive to do it.
Mike: Yes. I think I’d reinforce that using Pointerpro is about timing. It’s useful having tried other online tools – most of which are just survey tools, not true assessment tools. It helps you really understand the difference and the added value that a more sophisticated tool brings to your customers.
It’s an investment with a real business purpose, so you need to do the thinking and groundwork beforehand. If you don’t, you might end up frustrated.
Mike: They can go and find me as Mike Lander on LinkedIn, which is where I am quite a lot of the time. and also on piscari.com. And also I have a podcast called Higgle: the B2B sales club.
Mike: Thank you. It’s been a pleasure.
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About the author:
Jeroen De Rore
As Creative Copywriter at Pointerpro, Jeroen thinks and writes about the challenges professional service providers find on their paths. He is a tech optimist with a taste for nostalgia and storytelling.
